I recently read an interesting post on Femulate – When Men Dressing Like Women Stops Mattering – and that got me thinking (OK, before anyone aims this particular arrow in my direction, it got me overthinking). The post in itself was interesting, not least because there was disclosure at the outset that it was AI generated. And as usual, the AI did a pretty decent job of setting out the implications. It concluded that clothing would lose its moral charge, masculinity would become less brittle, professional life would quietly adapt, fashion would become more innovative (and more boring), social anxiety around gender would drop and relationships would rebalance subtly. It stressed that men would not become women, gender would not disappear, society would not lose structure or coherence and most people would still dress conventionally most of the time.
I was intrigued when I read this, so intrigued in fact that I left a comment questioning the philosophy of the whole premise. And as I was writing that comment, it struck me that it’s a far deeper issue than even the AI managed to convey. And never one to pass over the opportunity for a deep dive, I thought it would make for an interesting discussion here.
Of course, a common moan within the MTF movement is that it’s not fair that males should have to conform to such rigid gender stereotypes when women can pretty well wear what they like. And that in itself raises the question as to whether it’s even possible for a woman to crossdress these days. In raising that question, I don’t want to prompt the usual MTF cliché that presenting female is natural and going back to male mode is crossdressing because that’s not the point I’m making here. Both the original Femulate post and this post are simply about clothing, not gender identity and the truth is that women these days have appropriated pretty well everything that we would have historically defined as men’s clothing. A woman wearing flat shoes, trousers and a simple white shirt is simply a woman wearing flat shoes, trousers and a white shirt. ‘Boyfriend’ styles designed to project the idea that the wearer has borrowed their male partner’s clothes are frequent trends and short of binding her chest and sticking on fake facial hair, there’s very little a woman can do to give any clue that she’s in any way different.
At one time, the fundamental distinguisher between male and female clothing was trousers for men, skirts/dresses for women but those days now seem like ancient history. Take the humble denim jeans for example. In its basic form, it’s only the cut that differs between those intended for men and those for women and even that is often only obvious by close scrutiny. ‘Jeans’ as a generic term no longer implies intended gender and ‘unisex’ is really the only appropriate descriptor. Sometimes, though, the distinction is not as clear cut. The difference between a white collared & buttoned ‘blouse’ and a similar ‘shirt’ may once again just be the cut (and, perhaps, reversed buttons) and yet blouse normally describes a female garment, shirt tends to be male but can be unisex.
And then we have kilts. Again the word is unisex and yet no one would accuse male wearers of appropriating female fashion. And neither, if self-preservation was important, would we suggest to a male wearer that he was wearing a skirt!
This is perhaps an oversimplification of reality. I will happily wear trousers as part of my feminine presentation but when doing so, I’m aware that the fabric is softer and the cut is one that would not be found in the men’s department. Even so, I’ve heard it said on more than one occasion that wearing trousers is a wasted opportunity for a crossdresser, particularly when times to transform are few and far between. Equally, though, whilst my trousers are in a decidedly feminine wide leg style, I am well aware that I could get away with wearing a narrower legged style from the women’s department in my normal life and few who saw me would be any the wiser.
But the critical issue here is not my trousers but actually what I wear with them. For my last outing, they were worn with stiletto ankle boots, a feminine sweater & coat and accessorised with feminine jewellery. And let’s not forget the blonde wig, makeup and fake boobs & nails. On their own, those trousers probably wouldn’t have given me the feminine fix I crave but with all of the other feminine totems, I really felt the part wearing them. But what if all of those things were standard fare for men? After all, ‘is that a man or a woman?’ was a regular question when I was growing up in the 1960s as long hair for men came into fashion. Wide leg trousers, or bags as we called them, and high heeled platform boots were in fashion for males in the 1970s. And who can possibly forget the ‘New Romantic’ era of the early 1980s when men thought nothing of going out with a full face of makeup? Perhaps what distinguishes those from the acceptability for women to wear trousers is their transitory nature – the fashions quickly came and went. But that in itself raises an interesting question – have males rejected clothing & styles that are overtly feminine or has the general shirt in feminine clothes to more traditionally masculine styles (i.e. jeans, sweaters, sports shoes etc.) rendered more feminine styles unnecessary because the gap has narrowed so much in recent times?
But suppose all of those things had gained traction and in the four decades since, all clothing for either sex had gone the way of trousers? I often think it’s interesting to imagine a dystopian society where men and women are compelled to wear a simple boiler suit, with their head shaved and adornments like jewellery & makeup outlawed. Could crossdressing even exist? The whole premise of crossdressing is that a difference between clothing for women and men is a necessity. Strip away the gender labels on clothing and, regardless of whether we’re in the dystopian boiler suit society or a wear whatever you want society, we lose our reference point.
Arguably, some would say that we have started to lose our reference point anyway. A year or two, I was at a model train show and noticed a well-dressed woman in a cardigan & skirt, tights & heels. It probably took me less than a second to realise that she was somewhere on the trans spectrum, not because there was anything wrong with her presentation (in fact she had taken a lot of care with it) but because the few women who were there tended to dress in a similar way to the male visitors – i.e. extremely casually. The truth is that seeing women dressed as this individual was is becoming increasingly rare and much though I love my smart dresses and stiletto heels, I learned the hard way that to blend in and not draw attention to myself, I need to dress in a far more casual way when going out and about.
There is another angle to this, though, and that’s the question of choosing outfits not because they are labelled ‘women’s’ but because, quite simply, we like the style. I’ve bought (and purged) enough clothes in my time to know that some styles just don’t work on me and the fact that they’re women’s styles does not mitigate that. In a society where clothes have no gender, would I still gravitate towards, for example, stiletto heels because I like the style or would the impracticality of wearing them lead me to steer a wide berth? And on that note, I’ve already mentioned long hair, bags and high heeled platform boots. Back in the 1970s, I could be seen with all three! The question, of course, is was I attracted to those because of their style or because I subconsciously perceived that they blurred the lines between the sexes at a time when I was already realising that I was different?
But could there ever be a time when it’s socially acceptable for men to dress femininely, donning flamboyant clothes, silk stockings and high heels? Could men wearing long wigs and makeup ever be not just tolerated but admired? Most would declare that that could never happen but, of course, 17th century fashions for men not only encompassed those particular styles but also saw them as indicating status, wealth and even masculinity & virility. But crucially, there was still a distinction between male and female fashions and by the early 18th century men were already favouring practicality over flamboyance and left those totems to women. An early example of appropriation of male garments by the fairer sex?
As I was pondering how to bring this to a close, I found myself forming the opinion that society will never get to a point where men no longer baulk at the prospect of wearing women’s clothing because the simple truth is that most men wouldn’t want to and are quite happy to display their masculinity in male garments. But the title of the Femulate post – When Men Dressing Like Women Stops Mattering – perhaps hides the fact that the time may already have come. We go out and most of us are immediately recognisable for what we are and yet experience widespread acceptance with only the odd disapproving glance or other display of intolerance. Certainly, the experiences I’ve had bear this out and a couple of people I’ve engaged in conversation have given a clear indication that they have no problem with people like us.
And with that in mind, we have to be careful what we wish for. Do we want to inhabit a world where clothing no longer has any gender relevance? Do we want to inhabit a world where, instead of being seen as no different to any woman, we’re seen as no different to the bearded guy with a buzz cut just because we happen to be wearing an identical dress and heels to his? Do we want to inhabit a world where we can no longer seek fulfilment because the genders have merged to such a degree that there’s no divide to cross? For me, the answer to all of those is an emphatic ‘no’ and I’m just grateful that some women still dress like women and give me something to aim for!
12 Responses
Amanda, I have been doing just fine dressing the way I want to for a long time now , look back thousands of years ago when everyone wore pretty much the same clothes
Susie, that’s a very good point – no one to my knowledge has ever questioned why Fred Flintstone wore what was by modern standards a dress!
Amanda,
I’ll try and steer clear of the gender element and consider your point about clothes that men should be entitled to wear . Perhaps we should also consider the difference of view to how men and women see clothes .Women use clothes as an expression of how they feel and how they want to be seen by the outside world . Men see male clothes more as a practical thing , are they suitable for their type of work or leisure the big difference is how they see female clothes , the message a women intends to show is often read differently by men , they are often considering the sexual message , which is not usually the intention of most women .
There is still the glaring question of why would a man want to embarrass himself by wearing female styled clothes , we still have to basic questions of is he gay or does he want to be a woman , why is this so one sided women aren’t question in this way ?
I’m still not sold on the use or misuse of AI not matter how you word the question and consider how good it’s reply is you can never replace the human element , human’s don’t always give logical answers but they remain more important because they are based on the society we live in and not what a computer has been fed with .
I’ll finish with a couple of stories form the last couple of days . This morning I had a load of items which needed to go to the recycle centre , my garage has finally had a clear out , also I decided to clear the side of my garage to give a clearer pathway to the rear of my bungalow . As usual I had makeup on and an older wig , an old ( female ) Tshirt and ( female) Jeans even so I still received the same response from the guys at the recycle centre , as soon as I opened the boot lid they were there unloading and when I asked directions I had the usual , ” Over there me duck ! ” reply .
Yesterday I dropped in at the Citizen’s Advice Bureau because I could make very little sense of my Anglian Water bill . The same level of makeup a newer wig , peach coloured Tshirt with an off white denim skirt . The lady was wonderful she immediately saw a problem and called Anglian Water to sort it , she referred to me as she and her and then noticed the bill was addressed to MR Teresa H*****, so she soon requested that that should be changed , I had noticed but past it of as a computer glich . The explanation of the bill was my water meter had slowed down and then stopped , when they fitted a new smart meter they failed to inform me of the problem so I went from being in credit to a debit of £250.00 !
The point is I don’t talk about my gender , I no longer get into conversations about being transgender , I am simply treated from my visual presentation , I choose clothes partly for my mood but more importantly I dress appropriately for the circumstances . I admit I don’t like the current styles , part of the problem is women are getting larger , figure hugging clothes don’t work . I wonder if designers are getting lazy because it’s easier to adopt the unisex look .
Teresa, thank you for sharing your thoughts.
This is obviously a multi-layered issue with inherent contradictions. The most obvious contradiction is the freedom that society gives women to choose an outfit against the constraints that men are subject to but there’s the more puzzling one where a female presenting male is generally accepted whereas a man wearing women’s clothing evokes the responses you mention.
In some respects, the one way street of tolerance is understandable. Strip away the attitudes of modern life and the male of the species, whether homo sapiens or another animal, is ‘programmed’ to be the dominant one and any movement to femininity is perceived as a weakness whereas any woman displaying more masculine tendencies is rewarded with the epithet ‘boss girl’ or similar and applauded for standing up to the patriarchy! There’s also the practicality which many of us have come up against – the cut of women’s tailoring is not sympathetic to the male frame (not to mention those reversed buttons) whereas women can easily accessorise a shapeless men’s shirt to feminise it.
Your point ‘There is still the glaring question of why would a man want to embarrass himself by wearing female styled clothes…’ is an interesting one because it sets embarrassment as a foregone conclusion. I’m sure that if Mrs A (and many other wives) got to hear about our outings, they would ask that very question but the reality is that we don’t feel embarrassed even though for most of us, our provenance is obvious. That suggests there are two tipping points – the first when an individual passes the point at which it becomes obvious that, although presenting as male, he’s wearing women’s clothing and the second when he passes the point where he is perceived as presenting female.
But even if we put aside the reality that trans people are yesterday’s news and the experiences of all of us are almost universally positive, from time to time I’ve seen guys out and about who are wearing unambiguously female clothing – skirts & hosiery etc. – and yet ‘mutton chop’ side whiskers or similar leave no doubt that they’re occupying the middle ground. No one seems to stare or even care. Some will inevitably wonder whether they’re gay or want to be women and there are still environments, particularly work based ones, where the stereotypes and attached conventions persist but, for the most part, I think society has moved on to other issues.
for some reason Kandi’s stuff gets tied up with ads so I could not read all of what everyone had to write but I think one point has been overlooked–it’s just not the clothes for many of us but we couple them with jewelry ,wigs plus female mannerisms etc etc. The whole package
and also disagree re: males dressing just practical. consider the movie “Wall Street”??? with Michael Douglas. He wore a 3 piece suit to under score his power
Emily, I agree. It marks the difference between wearing women’s clothes and dressing as a woman.
And who can fail to smile at one of the all time great film/movie lines ‘lunch is for wimps’?! You’re right, though. Our business used to deal with a guy who ran a small company from his home somewhere in the north west of England. We didn’t see him often as most dealings were by email/phone but whenever he visited us, he was always immaculately turned out in suit and tie. His nails were always perfectly manicured (in a male style) and Mrs A always had something to say, sadly not complimentary!
Amanda,
While I only live twenty miles from my old home town the difference is so noticeable , while I prefer not to name them here the the old one is listed amongst the best in the UK both in history and also wealth . I have hardly noticed a crossdresser or transgender person , obviously it’s a sore point with my ex that I regularly visit it without any problems . My new home town was more a working town with heavy industry , I wonder does hardship make people more tolerant because I’ve seen far more crossdressers , sadly most stand out because they look terrible . Whether it’s fair or not even today people will look , they will snigger and comment to others .
Returning to the comment about embarrassment , that’s possibly the word most wives use and fear , did I ever feel embarrassed ? I have to admit only with my wife , the person we usually wish we could gain full acceptance usually totally rejects us , they will never understand how much that rejection hurts .
When I first decided to go full time I was adamant that I wouldn’t wear trousers but today it isn’t as simple as that , I sometimes feel that it’s a social reaction against femininity , no one wants to be girly anymore but it’s OK to be one of the guys . I know I’m lucky with my height and shape , it allows me to be more feminine both with my clothes and makeup , it has been noticeable that more ladies in my art groups are wearing makeup and more feminine clothes . With my National Trust group I can a little further again it has had an impact on the female members , I love the holidays with them as it’s great to dress up for the evening meal , ” Oh what’s she wearing tonight ! “
That’s an interesting observation about the contrast between the two towns and it raises the question as to whether it’s tolerance that leads to a greater concentration of CD/TG people in the second town or whether the concentrations are the same but the prosperity of the first leads to better blending in both directly from having the resources for a wider wardrobe and indirectly from being able to draw inspiration from what others are wearing. It’s sad when people snigger or make comments but I’m sure we’ve all been on the receiving end at some time or other, it goes with the territory, but often I think that it’s exacerbated by making either not enough or too much effort – getting the balance right takes time, practice and resources that not everyone has.
The trouser debate is an interesting one. For me, going out in trousers was transformative – the first time I did it, I had none of the worries that people would stare that had plagued earlier outings and it market the point when my confidence increased to the point where I no longer feared being among people or even talking to them. The great thing about them is that with the right pair, the outfit is not too dressy to stand out when nearly all women are wearing trousers or jeans and not too casual when people are more elegantly dressed and I found them a safe bet when I took the train into central London a few months ago.
Another great terse essay Amanda.
There are men and women’s clothes and there is MINE clothes. It doesn’t matter where it started (men’s or women’s store) it is just mine.
That said, I no longer have any ‘men’s’ pants that fit me. I have lost so much weight (65 lbs. ~ 30 kg) in the last 20 years and another 10 lbs. recently, that all my ‘male’ pants slide off me. Just order a new skyscraper jean size 8 T
and got four size 8 shorts.
I first switch to women’s shoes when I finally figure out that almost all of my considerable ankle and knee issues where cause by ill fitting shoes, aka, men’s shoes. I have women’s shaped feet that just didn’t fit into men’s shoes correctly. It was like walking with boats on.
I no longer have men’s shoes (only exceptions are my waders, ski boots, and some mud shoes). Almost 20 years wearing ‘women’s’ shoes and no real ankle or knee issues. I was scared of being embarrassed during the first weeks of wearing them, and they were only modest 2 inch booties. Today I rock 4+ inch heels all the time and think nothing of it.
20+ years ago, I was looking for a turtleneck in the men’s department of Macy’s and couldn’t fine anything I wanted. While walking out to my car I passed the turtlenecks in the Women’s Macy’s (we have both a Men’s Macy’s and a Women’s Macy’s), and there it was. the turtleneck exactly like what I was looking for. So I bought one. It fit, so I got another, and another, …
I like many items that I can only find in the women’s department, so I buy them and wear them (to work). I’m not embarrassed that 90%+ of what I wear was sold as women’s. In fact, I have had both men and women ask me where I bought items and some women have touch the material and commented on how it feels.
My clothing is now softer, more colorful, and fits better now. Show confidence and wear a smile.
Now to end along the new Kandi music list, just do what the 1988 Bobby McFerrin song tells you to
“Don’t Worry, Be Happy”.
Brevity is my middle name, Cali! Do you mind if I call you SuperCALIfragilisticexpialidocious from now on?🤣
I think many worry too much about the consequences of wearing the ‘wrong’ gendered clothes and that makes me wonder what they’re hiding. I can only speak from personal experience and whilst I am completely comfortable in a female presentation, I would always resist if Mrs A suggested I wear something that she’d originally bought for herself (I’m talking about unisex stuff here, not overtly feminine items) but, let’s face it, I was hiding a huge secret initially and even when Mrs A was aware it felt that my two worlds could get too close to each other for comfort.
Amanda,
My following comments have no factual basis or statistical backing or anthropological findings.
During the last 70 years North American and European societies have shifted dramatically in gender presentation. And indeed gender equality.
I think how each of us perceive CD/TD issues is based on when we were in our formative years (say age 5 to 20).
Growing up in the 1950s and 60s all the girls and women wore skirts/blouses or dresses. Men and boys wore pants and shirts (and ties). During the 2010s most people wore basically the same styles.
Being a child of the 1950s I think men who wear female clothing styles from 60 years ago are crossdressing. And vice versa for women.
Young people from the 2010s only know unisex attire. There is no such thing as crossdressing.
Therefore when I express my feminine nature it looks like a woman from my era. And I love it and I’m proud of how I look.
In 50 years I suspect men who express their feminine nature will look like – – – – men!
This is all my generalizations, an old codger.
Love you, a lot,
Jocelyn
Jocelyn, unsupported speculation & generalisation (ideally with a made up percentage to support it) always welcome but I think you may be onto something with your thoughts! There are certainly two strong memories that I have from my early childhood – one is a fascination with what were then referred to as ‘nylons’ and the other is hearing the ‘click-clack’ of stilettos on the pavement outside when I was in bed going to sleep and both now play a strong part in my own feminine presentation.
I guess the interesting question is whether there will ever come a time when skirts for men will become mainstream. Living in Greater London, I see a lot of ethnic minority males wearing what are probably best described as long robes and kilts in Scotland are already completely accepted (although tend to be worn for formal events rather than as everyday wear). Looking back over my lifetime, it’s not difficult to envisage these becoming trends but I suspect that even if they do, they’d go the same way as most trends and fade away within a year or two.
And you’re quite right to be proud of how you look. This is something that’s neither easy to deal with nor to get right but I think the reception you got whenever you went out proved mission accomplished!