A Different Perspective

By Amanda J.

The question of whether CDers should enter women’s spaces has cropped up in a couple of my recent posts here.  Whilst I don’t fear entering women-only spaces such as toilets & shop fitting rooms and have done so several times without issue, more recently I have felt conflicted on the whole thing, on the one hand feeling emboldened by the acceptance I have experienced but on the other wanting to respect women-only spaces which were so designated for a reason.  Particularly in the UK where I live, people are often reticent to voice their concerns but that doesn’t mean that they don’t have them and the last thing I want to do is to make anyone feel uncomfortable.  I was therefore particularly interested to read a woman’s view on the whole issue.

By way of background, I am a member of a small closed group of gender variant individuals ranging from CDers like me to several who are transitioning, some via HRT and, in one case, surgery.  But apart from all of us, there’s one more member – a natal woman whose husband is a CDer (the husband is not a participant in the forum) – I’ll refer to her as ‘S’ from now on.  To say that she’s an ally to the cause is an understatement – she’s supportive of the trans movement in general and all of us in particular.  She shares in the celebration of our highs and is always happy to offer gentle guidance to help us navigate the world we aspire to belong to.  She’s been particularly insightful on the whole issue of managing CDing within a marriage, not least because she struggled when her husband first confessed to her but eventually found it within herself to accept and support him.

One of the forum members recently highlighted an article in ‘Cosmopolitan’ in which the issue of the opening of a women-only gym where transwomen were excluded was discussed – you can read the article – Excluding trans women from a female-only gym reinforces narrow ideals of womanhood’ here.

Now, before I go on, I want to stress that I don’t intend to debate the validity or otherwise of either the article itself or the underlying issues concerning the gym.  We’re all entitled to have our own beliefs & opinions but trying to either impose those on others or get others to change their beliefs is ultimately fruitless.  

What was interesting though was what followed on the forum.  A couple of members immediately endorsed the views in the article reinforcing their endorsement with their own views.  And then S joined the discussion with the following:

“This is my take on trans-women in female spaces.

I don’t think the average female “takes notice of” or “pays attention” to the trans-world. I know that it may be hard to believe but, many women don’t have any trans-women in their little sphere (places they go around their immediate area – work, store, restaurants). The few trans-women that I see in my area are kind of on the creepy side (men wearing dresses with beards and motorcycle boots, talking to themselves). So, a trans-woman in a women’s locker room (as an example) would freak women out as seeing a man trying to be in the women’s private space for whatever reason. Women just don’t see that many, if any, trans-women.

All of you on this forum look like you pay attention to how you present yourselves out in the world, you look like women, you act like women, and I don’t think that would bother anyone that I know to see you out and about. Most wouldn’t give you a second notice. But you must realize that not all trans-women look, act, or talk like women, and women don’t really care to share private space with them.

The average woman doesn’t know who is or who isn’t on female hormones, they immediately think “creeper” if they give off a man vibe. They don’t know whose libido is low nor do they care. 

I work out every day and change in the locker room, so I hear how women talk and think. 

So sorry for the way things are. You can’t control how women think about you until or unless they get to know you. Then I’m sure that they would be comfortable. 

I doubt it would be safe for any trans-women to be in the men’s locker room either. You would not feel safe there. But that’s the vibe women get from trans-women, they are just unsure.

So, I know you are not a threat, you know you aren’t a threat, but a woman who has been suspicious (as a safety mechanism), who has been raised to be wary of certain things all of her life, is going to be nervous. 

You will just have to gain trust and until then, realize not all women are going to embrace your presence in a women’s private space.”

I have to confess that after pasting that into the draft of this post, I looked at the screen for the best part of ten minutes trying to think of something profound to say.  But how do you follow such an insightful, honest and balanced view of the world in which we seek acceptance?  Further explanation is certainly unnecessary, so clear is the way that S set out the situation.  It’s impossible to argue with anything she said because these were not the thoughts of someone trying to make an anti-trans viewpoint somehow palatable.  These were the words of an ally spoken not to put us down but to gently explain the less positive aspects of a world that we seek to enter but she inhabits by birthright.

As with many things in life, we ignore sage advice at our peril.  I recently wrote about my misgivings about using women’s changing rooms to try on clothes in shops (A Question of Acceptance – 2 – Second Thoughts (https://kandis-land.com/a-question-of-acceptance-2-second-thoughts)) and the general consensus in the comments was that I was overthinking things and maybe I was.  My misgivings were not as a result of hostility from any other user, in fact the only other customer I encountered while in the space either didn’t notice or didn’t care and was very polite when she realised she was blocking my view in the mirror, but from a nagging feeling that not everyone would be completely fine with my presence and I had no way of knowing who fell into that category.  

But a more inconvenient truth that comes across in S’s words is that we are viewed as different.  We can self-identify however we wish but, equally, others are free to identify us however they wish.  And the reality here is that our assertion that we identify as a woman is meaningless if others don’t see us in the same way.  But the message here isn’t ‘get out and stay out’, it’s just ‘tread carefully’ because acceptance has to be earned, not taken for granted.

And that presents us  with a genuine dilemma.  Should we respect that whether we like it or not, women-only spaces have been so designated for a reason and it is not up to us to redefine who can and cannot use those spaces to suit our own purposes?  Or do we have a responsibility to demonstrate that we are not the threat that some may fear us to be and set out to win hearts and minds, one encounter at a time?  And even if we take the latter stance, are we really winning over hearts and minds or just, for want of a better expression, negotiating a pass solely for ourselves as individuals?

To me, that question is important.  S raises the issue of ‘men wearing dresses with beards’ and in the discussion that followed, another member of the group observed that they are damaging to our cause and I am inclined to agree.  They of course are an extreme example and whilst we may not place them in the same category as ourselves, the rest of society may not make that distinction.  And that then raises the question as to where do we draw the line (and also whether we have any right to draw a line in the first place)?  What about a transwoman with male pattern baldness that chooses not to wear a wig?  Or the flamboyant CD who dresses in a way that screams ‘sex worker’?  Or the CDer who wears just a dress and a cheap wig without makeup, not because they’re trying to make a point but because they lack the resources and knowhow to go any further?  We can argue that they draw attention to themselves and, by association, the CD/TG community as a whole but does their failure to meet our standards, either through intent or through necessity, strip them of the right to live as they want to live and make them any less worthy of respect?

The sad truth is that society is inherently unfair.  It’s sad that height, build or facial features mean that some in our position will always be seen for what they are and experience discrimination as a result.  It’s sad that some people lack the resources and support to be able to get their transformations to a level that others will not notice them and will perhaps experience scorn or ridicule as a result.   It’s sad that those who seek to live an honest life are tarred with the same brush as others who see the whole thing as a self-indulgent game.  But that’s the world we live in.

So what is the message here?  The simple answer is to understand that not everyone sees us in the same way that we see ourselves.  We can protest that we identify as a woman or declare that we’ve always been a woman but that counts for nothing if others view us differently.  But as I said above, we ignore sage advice at our peril.  What’s important about this piece of advice is it neither tells us to keep clear nor to enter with impunity.  It just gives us a perspective on which to base our own decisions, a perspective which under normal circumstances is almost impossible for us to hear.

I’ve always looked on acceptance of me as conditional.  It’s conditional on how I look – get it wrong and I have no doubt that it’ll only be a matter of time before I hear ‘that was a guy’ exclaimed by someone I’ve just walked past.  It’s conditional on where I am – the waitress who paid me such a nice compliment during a recent hotel stay may well have not been so willing to engage if our encounter had been in the local gym changing room rather than the hotel restaurant.  It’s conditional on how I act – any indication that I am not ‘all in’ and I suspect that the warmth I experience from those I interact with will just evaporate.  But in saying that, I have to accept that even if I get everything 100% right, acceptance may still not be forthcoming.  In and amongst all of the wonderful encounters I’ve had are a few where I’ve sensed that all was not well – the businesslike but emotionless shop assistant, a smirk from a passer-by, a scowl from a fellow shopper.  Perhaps I should be grateful that British reserve prevented those particular situations from escalating and were soon pushed to the back of my mind but they did serve as a reminder that our acceptance is not universal and not guaranteed.  But I also like to think that even if there’s immediate disapproval or scorn, the needle is moved a little bit in the right direction – maybe those people had never seen someone like me before and perhaps next time they encounter a trans person, they’ll think ‘there’s another one’ rather than ‘look at the state of that!’.  Rome wasn’t built in a day and the sad truth is that most of us won’t live long enough to see universal widespread acceptance of us as we aspire to be accepted but every encounter we have can help the cause, even if we sense that all was not well.  Those who went before us had to endure far worse than we can ever imagine and we owe them a huge debt of gratitude for paving the way for the widespread acceptance we experience now..

It’s a wonderful experience to sense that we’re being accepted for who we are.  It’s our reward for all of the anxieties & frustrations that we experience and the hard work & effort we put into being the best version of womanhood we can possibly be.  And whilst S’s words inevitably ring warning bells that our acceptance into the feminine world may not be as straightforward as we thought it was, they also offer reassurance that the smiles & warmth we experience suggest that we’re at least on the right track.

There is something quite beautiful about life in our world.  Superficially, of course, it’s seeing the inner woman emerge in a form that we once thought was beyond our wildest dreams.  But far more beautiful as far as I’m concerned is being able to experience life in the feminine world firsthand – particularly the platonic closeness that could never happen when we present male due to the ever present threat of sexual overtones inherent in close encounters of the heterosexual kind.  And reading S’s words will make me cherish those interactions even more because they demonstrate not only that I am being accepted but, more importantly, that I am being trusted.  And to me, there’s no greater compliment than that.

Share:

15 Responses

  1. Amanda,
    This is an exceptional post which provides a lot for readers to think about. It may prompt a great discussion on the issue.

    But as you have said, any discussion will probably not change anyone’s opinion. Therefore I will not be delving into this. This is not a debate, it is a discussion.

    I have, as I’m sure everyone in the world has, been in situations where I came in contact with someone who looked or acted very differently from what I consider “normal”. The situation made me feel uneasy. Was it their fault I felt uneasy? No. Was it my fault? No.

    There is no right or wrong. We have to be more accepting of each other. Life is not a “one way street”.

    Sorry, no words of great wisdom from me.

    Love,
    Jocelyn

    PS – maybe that’s the key “LOVE”

    1. Jocelyn, thank you for your kind words and support.

      The thing that particularly struck me about what S wrote was the realisation that women have subconscious protection mechanisms. It’s not prejudice or anything like that, just an innate need to be wary until they have confirmation of safety. And it underlines that how others view us is all that really matters. We know that we pose no threat but, initially at least, they don’t and that in turn raises the question as to whether it’s fair for us to place others in a situation they may find uncomfortable. But she also makes the point that our safety (and, indeed, dignity) is a consideration too.

      I think all of us here have stories of wonderful acceptance to relate and to draw a positive from S’s words, that’s almost certainly a testament to how we act in the outside world. And perhaps that’s the most important message from all of this – act in a way that puts others at ease and nice things will happen.

      Ultimately, we can only do what we feel is right but it’s always good to play with a full deck of cards, so to speak. And as soon as I read what S had written, I knew that I wanted to share it with a wider audience and was very happy to get her agreement to do this.`

  2. Amanda,
    As usual you open up so much to debate on .
    I totally agree that many people have never experienced a CDer or transgender person , the majority will possibly pass by without noticing and as you comment the ones that choose to be different for whatever reason are the ones that set the tone for the rest . I have taken part in heated debates with others over having the right to comment on their appearance , do they let us down ? conversly they could point their finger at us and accuse of something similar ?
    It’s good to have a friend like S , they do help pave the way for us , I spent most of my time at social meetings talking to wives , their insights were very useful , BUT she is biased , she has thankfully accepted her CDing husband because she still values him as a husband .
    I’m not sure if we will ever resolve the question of ” Women Only Spaces ” . My thoughts are split , on the one hand certain spaces offer security for women on the other I’ve known two friends who fully transitioned , they no longer fit into a male environment what choice do they have but use female facilities .
    Recently I took up playing tennis again , I wore a white skort and Tshirt , I could hardly walk into male toilets , I will add I used female toilets but not their changing rooms as I arrived kitted out . The aftermath was I damged my ankle which I had checked at a sport injury clinic , they retained my details so I recently recived a message to attend a small all female back therapy sessions . I do have a problem with my back but but it’s not covered by the sessions , so I declined the offer on that basis and not gender .

    Again I see the problem is one of unfounded fear . As I’m full time I have had to set those fears aside , I can’t spend every day thinking about right and wrong facilities . I very quickly stopped looking over my shoulder to see what reponse I was getting , I had to be confident and trust my appearance is good enough to permit me to live an unhindered life . You have to consider a second look might not be because you’ve been read they could be checking out what you’re wearing .

    Perhaps you summed it up in your last paragraph by talking about TRUST , it’s not a very big word but it can mean so much especially to the transgender community .

    1. Teresa, thank you for sharing your thoughts.

      The idea of conditional acceptance is very important to me. As I wrote in the post and have said in the past, I try to avoid female-only spaces but the bottom line is that there is no way that I am going to set foot in men-only spaces when presenting female. I don’t feel that I would be in any particular danger by doing so (although the risk is obviously higher than when I’m in my normal guise) but it’s a question of dignity, both for myself and for other users who don’t particularly want to see a woman in there even if I’m only superficially a woman. So in choosing to enter female spaces, I do so knowing that I am a guest, not there by right. And in doing so, I not only try to respect the norms of the environment but also add an additional one – keep my mouth shut because my voice is my biggest giveaway and whilst anyone seeing me while I talk may be accepting, S’s words leave no doubt that without the visual cue, the sound of a male voice in a female space would almost certainly engender fear.

      What I valued most from S’s words was the insight into something it’s very difficult for us to appreciate. We may ‘identify’ as women, dress as women, act as women and even live our lives as women but that counts for nothing if we’re not viewed in a similar way by others. Moreover, without the lived experience as girls & women and without the innate conditioning that chromosomes give, it’s easy to be ignorant of things that to natal women is second nature.

  3. You are on another roll Amanda. Back to back excellent articles. S’s dialogue brought up several points that I hadn’t thought of. I have felt the vulnerability that women feel and it isn’t pleasant. This was back in the 60’s when as a teenager I went to Vancouver by my self and walked around down town and Stanley park. It was both exciting but more so terrifying. Back then it wasn’t uncommon to hear about a CD or Trans person getting beaten up. I don’t think I breathed until I was back in my car heading home.

    1. Trish, thanks!

      I’m glad that S’s dialogue prompted thought because that’s why I was so keen to share it. I think it’s important that we view our feminine lives from multiple perspectives even if the truth is sometimes a little uncomfortable.

      And thank you for sharing what was obviously a disconcerting experience – again a reminder that risks are there, often risks that we haven’t been conditioned in our upbringing to either recognise or deal with.

  4. as indicated-the bottom line is that if you are out for a long time and have to use the bathroom the obvious choice is the ladies room. if you don’t come even closer to “passing” that represents a real problem
    how about this:-in the USA decades ago we passed the Americans With Disabilities Act. The Act stated that reasonable accommodations must be made for the disabled. Using that as a standard it certainly would seem to be reasonable for someone with gender dysphoria to use a dressing room or ladies room. The person with a beard does not have GD or are nuts.
    To those who try but don’t come close to passing the act is really saying society doesn’t have to accommodate you. Plan ahead or look for family restroom etc. Well this a try anyway. I would also say that if I go to a crowded event I become very uneasy if the ladies is mobbed with gals waiting.

    1. Emily, thank you – you make some very good points. Sadly, as you allude to, life is unfair and some of us are going to have a smoother ride than others even if we make equal effort. And I know that the 21st century view is not to view things like facial hair as a barrier to identifying as a woman but the reality is that natal women so afflicted either get it seen to or work in a circus!

      1. Amanda,
        I have to tell you that there are women that have had multiple laser sessions and still their facial hair continue to grow. My nail artist shaves I think at least once a week.

        1. It must be a horrible thing for them to have to deal with – at least society allows men a choice in the matter.

    2. Emily,
      I had a couple of incidents that happened during a social group party in a hotel . On the first occasion I chose to play safe and use disabled facilities but I learnt my lesson when a disabled person told me to use the correct one next time . On another occasion I stood hestitating which one to use when GG from one of the other parties grabbed me by the arm and dragged me into the ladies restroom saying , ” for goodness sake no one is going to worry about a lady like you !! ”

      Amanda ,
      I guess after eight years it’s stopped being a problem with my acceptance . As for my voice it hasn’t proved a problem , as I’ve mentioned before I wear hearing aids so with or without I can’t truly say what my voice sounds like . The one problem is trying to stifle a cough or sneeze in those circumstances men and women do sound very different .

      I can’t fully understand why the UK makes such an issue over ” female only spaces ” when so many other countries don’t , I still say it’s more to do with personalities connected with the political scene , as a vunerable minority we are just pawns in their games !!

      1. Ultimately, the female space issue is cultural. I was watching something on TV the other day, don’t remember what, but whoever it was pointed out that in Finland, men and women happily sit naked together in the sauna! And then there’s the issue that I mentioned a week or two ago where I’d seen notices on both ladies and gents toilets somewhere saying that operatives of either sex could be working in each – so it’s OK for a male toilet attendant to be in the ladies but not a female presenting male?!

        In the end, and this is why I wanted to post this, we just need to understand how people may feel and be sympathetic to that

        1. Amanda,
          Just a last word about toilets and cleaning staff , I was in male mode with my wife and friends waiting to be called for a flight (this was a few years ago ) so I nipped to the toilet before going through the departure gates . As I stood at the urinal a wet mop swirled round my feet , as I turned to see what was happening a young polish girl smiled and apologised for wetting my shoes , needless to say my urge completely dried up .

          As for Dee’s comment about not speaking while engaged , my GG friends treat me totally as Teresa so if I happen to be in the loo and someone talks to me I can’t ignore them .

  5. Just because S has that opinion and she is a GG doesn’t mean she speaks for all GGs. She speaks for one GG, and that is her.

    I also have met members of our group who have transitioned and frankly, some of S’s statements are insulting to transwomen. I have talked with those members and I find their stories fascinating.

    I have a number of GG friends and they have no issue when I go into the loo with them. I just ask them not to talk to me because I don’t want to answer when I’m in the loo.

    Once again, you are overthinking it.

    And last, for once and for all, a man with a beard has the exact same right to wear a dress as we do. It cannot be tolerance for me and none for thee. We cannot ask for acceptance and then blame someone who does not meet our standards when they don’t. Everyone has the right to dress as they see fit.

    1. Dee, unfortunately, one person’s opinion can be another person’s insult.

      I shall not risk offending you with an overthought response but would say that what people wear is their, and only their, business. However, women have every right to determine who can enter their spaces and it is up to us to conform, not them to yield.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Recent Comments

  • Recent Comments

  • Featured Posts

    Get The Latest Updates

    Subscribe To Our Newsletter

    Sign up for the first look at Kandi’s outfits, blog posts, and product recommendations.

    Keep Reading

    More From Amanda J.